Episode 179 - Sharon Houghton, Outside Inc.
In this episode of Soul of Travel, Season 5: Women's Wisdom + Mindful Travel, presented by @journeywoman_original, Christine hosts a soulful conversation with Sharon Houghton.
With over 15 years of experience in the media and Outdoor industries, Sharon is a sales and revenue leader who oversees notable brands and leads a robust team of creative, results-oriented, and passionate people.
As the SVP of Sales at Outside, Sharon is focused on delivering results that impact the organization and its audiences. Sharon has managed and built numerous growth-based portfolios. She is a strategic thinker, a team and culture builder, a business partner, and a product developer who strives to find new solutions and tools to move the business forward in sustainable ways. Driven by integrity, accountability, and innovation - Sharon is a lifelong learner who loves to solve problems and take on challenges.
Beyond work, Sharon is a mom to two kids (8 & 11) and an athlete that loves to travel. If she can run and swim on her travels around the world, even better!
The Journey to Outside
Sharon is grateful to get to spend her days working across the entire Outside platform with partners in different areas, with her primary focus being her strategic partnerships, sales, advertising, and an exciting new event for 2024.
While Outside is media as its core, Sharon appreciates that so many different arenas intersect in the Outside world.
Sharon grew up as an Air Force “Brat,” moving around every two or three years, both in Japan and in the U.S. She credits this experience as giving her a love and passion for travel, seeing so many places and embedding travel, fitness, and exploration into her DNA. After she graduated from college, she left Texas and was motivated to get to Colorado for its outdoor adventures.
The Intersection of Outdoors
Sharon explains that Outside’s mission is to get more people outside–and while that sounds so simple, it’s not! Sharon shares that she’s lucky and privileged to live in Boulder, Colorado. “When you really look at the access that people have to the outdoors, or the comfort level that people have or don’t have in the outdoors–and then you talk about the mental health aspect of it…but it’s not accessible for everyone, or safe or comfortable.”
The approach that Outside takes is one of service journalism, welcoming people into the outdoors world and conversation in a way that’s both fair and educational.
Christine and Sharon discuss the shifts in structure that have changed over the years in Outside Inc. from the print magazine and OutsideOnline.com. About four years ago, CEO Robin Thurston purchased a series of different media organizations in the travel and outdoor, active lifestyle space. Now, Outside is a house of brands under the Outside Inc. umbrella and a number of channels in which consumers are reached, from TV to print, the digital landscape, utility and GPS apps, and events. “It’s now the home for active and outdoor enthusiastic–and travel is the heart of what we do,” shares Sharon.
Across the Outside audience, folks are interested and doing different activities. And in comparison to other brands that discuss inclusivity or use inclusive imagery, Outside embodies this in the very structure of the organization. Efforts include hiring and bringing new and diverse photographers, writers, and other creators to the table. Getting more people exposed to the outdoors takes mindful discussion and thoughtful intention every step of the way.
Outside Festival 2024
The Outside Festival in Denver scheduled for June 1st & 2nd, 2024 is the first festival of its kind in the area featuring music, gear, rock climbing walls, demos, and fun! The aim is to become the SXSW for the outdoor industry as a fun place to foster interaction and collaboration between consumers and industry professionals. Kids 12 and under gain free entry, and ticket prices are affordably priced to create the opportunity for as many folks as possible to access the experiences.
The event takes place in the heart of Denver in Civic Center Park. Throughout the weekend, the Denver Art Museum is partnering to host the event’s film and ideas summit. Guest speakers include Shaun White, Quannah Chasinghorse, Dhani Jones, Scott Lehman, and Shayna Unger – all conversations set to move the needle for the industry, “and move the needle for people to see themselves in the outdoors that maybe don’t already,” says Sharon.
Bringing More Voices into the Outdoor Travel Industry
Christine and Sharon also discuss the role and the evolution of women in leadership in the outdoor travel space. Challenging perspectives, assumptions, and the status quo are all paramount when it comes to creating balanced industries that can do more – together.
“We bring a different level of empathy; we bring a different level of perspective. And it’s so imperative to have a seat at the table.”
Both mothers of current eight-year-olds, Christine and Sharon also discuss the intentionality required to use language and structures to welcome pride and confidence in the way our girls feel about themselves.
“We bring a different level of empathy; we bring a different level of perspective. And it’s so imperative to have a seat at the table.”
Soul of Travel Episode 179 At a Glance
In this conversation, Christine and Sharon discuss:
· The intersection between all things outdoors
· The intentional evolution of business toward more sustainable and inclusive behaviors
· Engaging with nature through mindful travel experiences
· Shifting–and expanding–definitions of travel and adventure
· The importance of women’s voices in healthy business ecosystems
Join Christine now for this soulful conversation with Sharon Houghton.
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Related UN Sustainable Development Goals
Sustainable Development Goal #3: Ensure healthy lives and promote well-being for all at all ages.
Sustainable Development Goal #5: Achieve gender equality and empower all women and girls.
Sustainable Development Goal #10: Reduce inequality within and among countries.
Sustainable Development Goal #11 Make cities and human settlements inclusive, safe, resilient and sustainable.
Sustainable Development Goal #12: Ensure sustainable consumption and production patterns.
Resources & Links Mentioned in the Episode
Learn more and purchase tickets to the Outside Festival!
Connect with Sharon Houghton on LinkedIn.
Visit Outside for outdoor news, tips, and gear.
For national sponsorship or advertising opportunities with Outside, please email Sharon at shoughton@outsideinc.com.
Get your copy of Coming Home by Brittney Griner, Sharon’s current can’t-miss read.
About the Soul Of Travel Podcast
Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of people making a positive impact in the tourism industry. In each episode, you’ll hear the stories of women who are industry professionals, seasoned travelers, and community leaders. Our expert guests represent social impact organizations, adventure-based community organizations, travel photography and videography, and entrepreneurs who know that travel is an opportunity for personal awareness and a vehicle for global change.
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Soul of Travel Episode 179 Transcript
Women’s travel, transformational travel, sustainable travel, women leaders in travel, social entrepreneurship
Christine: welcome to soul of travel podcast. I'm Christine. And today I am excited to be sitting down with Sharon Houghton, who is the SVP of sales and strategic partnerships at outside. And this is a really great conversation.
Christine: Timely. We met just a few weeks ago and I was immediately very excited to have a conversation and we're going to get into the more timely aspects of it. of it towards the end of our conversation but very excited to have you here today. Welcome to the podcast.
Sharon: Thanks, Christine. Super excited to be here and very timely, which I'm excited to explore.
Christine: Yeah. Well, to begin our conversation, I'm actually going to just turn it over to you. I'll let you introduce yourself and tell our listeners a little bit more about who you are and what it is that you do at Outside.
Sharon: Sure. Absolutely. So yeah, you mentioned that I'm the SVP of sales and marketing here at outside. I've been in the outdoor active lifestyle media space for 20 years. As an athlete myself, I just feel very lucky that my personal passions and my profession have collided. Cause that's very, unique and probably not very common.
Sharon: And so, you know, I really get to spend my days working with various partners across our entire platform at Outside, really working on our strategic partnerships, our sales and sort of traditional advertising. And then we have a big new event that we're working on this year that I know we'll get to.
Sharon: And that's been a lot of my focus. Here in the last eight months or so so it's just a really fun brand and a really fun industry. And it really dovetails a handful of industries. So even though it is Media kind of at its core. We cover endurance sports, travel, and I'm excited to talk a little bit more about that and my personal passions for travel.
Sharon: Of course, just general outdoor enthusiast topics and, and, you know, do that across a lot of different mediums here at outside too.
Christine: Yeah, I think it's great, we, we met at the Adventure Travel Trade Association event here in Denver. So we already were, Meeting in a space where, you know, outdoors and travel were intersecting, especially in the adventure travel space. And I think it's always interesting because there's this like positionality of it being two different things, but but they are, you know, very interconnected.
Christine: And so I think I think, it will be interesting to look at that as we're going through this conversation as well. Well, one of the first things I always ask my guests and I'm looking forward to hearing from you is, have you always, you know, you mentioned you were athletic and you, you know, liked to be you know, you're combining those passions with your career, but have you always been drawn to the outdoors and to travel?
Christine: Has that always been a part of your life?
Sharon: Yeah, that's a great question. So I was an air force brat growing up. My dad was in the air force and. with that comes moving around every two or three years. So I spent my life up until just about going to high school, moving every two or three years. And that was both overseas. We did a stint in Japan for a handful of years and then all over the United States.
Sharon: And I think that is really what gave me my love and passion for travel because I got to see so many places and my parents were So great about, especially when we were in Japan and overseas, which was, you know, in the eighties you know, very different in terms of communicating with family back in the U S but they were just really great at taking us and seeing, seeing all of Japan.
Sharon: Cause we knew we only had a limited amount of time there. And then, you know, certainly we did that a lot too, and in the U S a lot more car trips and camping. We lived in the Southeast and in the Southwest and I was born and then my dad ultimately retired in Texas. I, as soon as I graduated from college, I left Texas and haven't looked back and wanted to get to Colorado for all of the outdoor adventures that it definitely brings.
Sharon: So it definitely has always been. In my DNA, I wouldn't say I grew up like a competitive athlete necessarily, but I was always into health and fitness and activity. I actually got my undergraduate degree in exercise science. So I was always drawn to just an active lifestyle, eating well, you know, that definitely connects to the outdoors.
Sharon: Like you want to be outside and you want to travel to be active. And so those things sort of always intersected for me. And I I've done, I've been lucky to do a lot of travel through my job and also personally. So hopefully we can talk a little bit about that.
Christine: Yeah, when I was young, I always had this kind of romanticized idea that I wished that I was an army brat. My dad was in the military, but you know, had left well before I was born, but I would hear that or see that. I'm like, Oh, that's a way people can travel. And now I have three daughters that were all born in different states.
Christine: And it's so difficult and I'm so glad that that actually wasn't my reality because, you know, there's the things that we think are going to be great about it. And then there's the, the reality of those experiences. But it was something I always thought would have been an incredible way to kind of be prompted to have to travel and change up your environment.
Sharon: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think it's, you know, there's pros and cons for sure. Right before we retired in Texas, my dad had the opportunity to possibly go to Germany. At this point, my brother and I were almost in high school. And now I, it's easy for me to look back with such wanderlust and say, that would have been So amazing as a teen and being in Europe, especially it's so easy to travel.
Sharon: I'm sure if my parents had moved us over there when I was 16, I would have hated them for it at the time. And we ultimately ended up in Texas, but I do think it's a good. It comes with some hardships too, but I feel very blessed.
Christine: Yeah. Well, I wanted to get into, you know, how we connected and again, back to the ATTA events. And you were there to talk about the event that's coming up here in Denver, Outside Festival. And I had seen your name on the list of the event, you know, before we got there and I thought, Oh my gosh, how great.
Christine: I, you know, I have spent a lot of time engaging with the outside magazine and online, you know, media, and I would find that the things that always resonated were conversations or articles about inclusivity in the outdoor space. And so I think that's something that's really important to both of us. And that's what I would really love to dive in.
Christine: I know it's some of the premise of festival. But I would like to talk a little bit about Why that is so important, I think, especially right now in the industry and even what that means in terms of making the outdoors more inclusive.
Sharon: Yeah, no, absolutely. I think certainly as we get into the festival, we can talk about why that's a foundational goal of that particular event, but it really is a foundational goal and mission more of outside. You know, our mission is to get more people outside and it sounds so simple, but it's not right.
Sharon: And I know that I'm, Lucky or call it privilege that I live here in Boulder, Colorado. And it's just what people do. And I'm raising my kids to love the outdoors, but when you, you know, so a little bit in a bubble here in the Boulder Denver area, but when you really look at the access that people have to the outdoors or the comfort level that people have or don't have in the outdoors and then you talk about the mental health aspect of it.
Sharon: You know, one thing that we talk a lot about it outside is the future generations of the outdoors. And how so many kids are growing up on their screens. I mean, I have an eight and 11 year old and thankfully my kids you know, have had more restricted screen time and are very active. So I feel very lucky, but I know that it's a force that's only going to get harder as they get into their teen years and potentially have phones and social media.
Sharon: And so just the mental health aspects of getting outdoors. So there's a lot of different facets, of course, of that the outdoors helps you with, but it's not accessible. For everyone and or people don't feel safe or comfortable or even know where to start. And so we really try like our brands under the outside umbrella.
Sharon: We really look at as service journalism. How do we help and inform people to get outdoors? And as part of our mission over the past few years. We've really been focused on making sure there's more representation, so that as people, you know, come into our ecosystem outside, they feel like they can be seen, or they feel like they fit, have more conversations through our podcasts, you know, make sure that representation through outside TV, you know, is fair, and again, educational, right?
Sharon: You know, because I think outside historically, Can be seen as, Oh, if I'm not bombing down a black diamond or jumping off the side of a cliff, then it's not for me. And certainly we do have those level of athletes within our ecosystem, but it's such a small sliver, right? Like it's more the aspirational person who wants to run their first 5k or just get outside and do something.
Sharon: So we're really trying to make sure that our content as well is more approachable so that, you know, we can just introduce more people to the outdoors in whatever way that is for them. Yeah,
Christine: I wanted to actually back it up for a minute cause I know we mentioned that you work for outside and outside ink. And I think a lot of people are probably really familiar with the print magazine, right? That's the thing that comes to my mind is the big O. So that's what I immediately resonate with.
Christine: But can you share a little bit about the structure? Cause I think that's maybe something that's changed over the years, but to give an idea of what, what we're talking about.
Sharon: no, that's a great question. I think super relevant. And so outside, most people are familiar with the magazine and then outside online. com the brand has been around for decades and really well known and loved and respected in the industry. About four years ago our CEO, Robin Thurston, who started the map, my fitness, Matt, my hike, Matt, my run, those apps had always been in the outdoor enthusiast space.
Sharon: Ended up buying a handful of different media organizations that played in this space. Right. And so it was brands like Velo news and women's running and triathlete, more core titles, and then brands like backpacker and ski and Warren Miller and yoga journal, all probably very familiar to. Either this audience or just the outdoor enthusiast, active lifestyle.
Sharon: And that's actually the company I came from, which was owned by active interest media that had those, you know, like I said, yoga, journal, climbing ski. And then in the spring of 2021, we purchased outside and kept that name as the company name, because it's so well revered in the industry. But now we are both a house of brands.
Sharon: So there's all of those brands plus more that I didn't even mention. under the outside umbrella. So outside ink. And then of course we still have And we have the website and within that ecosystem, lots of different channels in which we touch consumers, everything from live events to podcasts, to TV, to print, to just our digital landscape, as well as a handful of different utility and GPS apps.
Sharon: So yes, outside has changed a lot in the last four years, but it's really now the home for the active outdoor lifestyle enthusiast. And I know we'll probably get into this a little bit more, how we dovetail into travel, but travel is really at the heart, is the heartbeat of what we do, because it's all about where to go.
Sharon: And then it's, what do you do in those places? Right? So we often win awards for our travel content and it really is a big focus of our brands at its core.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. Cause I know, again, as I was preparing for that event and then just looking and seeing I was like, Oh, I didn't realize that all of these things are now in this one space and I'm like, Oh my gosh, this is huge. This is all that all of these voices are together. And, and like you said, just kind of Painting a different picture of outside, which I think is really speaks to the inclusivity piece is because yes, I can do yoga and I can identify as someone who loves the outdoors, or I can, you know, be Warren Miller person and identify as someone who loves the outdoors.
Christine: And I think adventure travel has the same you know, sometimes has the same difficulties in it. Inviting people into the space because I think for a long time that was the perception that was painted. It's also the one that's most, I guess, immediately engaging, like we're in awe of the person that can, you know, jump off these cliffs or run, you know, multiple marathons across Africa or Those stories are the ones that kind of are a catalyst for the what if and the biggest possibility.
Christine: But at the same time, they also close the doors for people who don't see themselves in those stories. And so I think that one, like seeing all those brands under that umbrella, To me, just showed me that idea of inclusivity just in the structure and then, you know, changing that narrative. So I would love to, to hear a little bit about maybe what that's looked like over the past four years as you are looking at what people want from the outdoors, how they engage in that, in that space, what that means to them and, and how it might be different than from in the past.
Sharon: Yeah, no, that's a great question. I think that, you know, one of the things that we looked at as we were building and putting together all of outside is like, you know, to your point, someone may be a marathon runner, or they may be a runner, but nobody just does one thing for the most part, right? Like, we know across the survey, right?
Sharon: of our audience that most people are dabbling. Now they're not going to do this many activities every year, all year, but it's roughly around 12 activities. Like I do yoga. I also swim, I run none of it all competitively, but it's all part of my lifestyle and routine. And if someone asked me to go for a hike, I'm eager to go.
Sharon: Right. So we know that across our audience. So many people are doing multiple things. I think as we talk about making it more inclusive, I think, you know, when a lot of brands go down that path, it's about imagery and just making sure that people can see themselves in these images. And while that's great, it can also become inauthentic.
Sharon: It can come off performative. And so while that's certainly an important piece to do in an authentic way, we've, I wouldn't even say it's a step further because it's simply the right thing to do, but we've really been focused on hiring new and diverse. photographers, right? They're behind the lens, right?
Sharon: And making sure that they have a space or a writer or, you know, because they're the ones that are going to bring to life that photography shoot in an authentic way, whether, you know, you've got more diverse folks in the, in the imagery or not. And so just really making sure that we bring a lot of different Voices to the table, photographers, creators to the table, and that we're talking to and expanding our audience.
Sharon: Like we want to grow our audience as a brand, certainly with the goal in mind of getting more people exposed to the outdoors. But that takes a lot of really mindful discussion and really mindful ways in the way that we do that before we even go to market to make sure that it's, you know, done in an authentic way.
Sharon: And by no means are we perfect. We have a long ways to go. I think this work. Never ends. It's something that we, you know, you have to constantly be mindful of and thinking about every day.
Christine: Yeah, well, and I, I think too, just in the past four years, five years, the, the language that we have that we didn't have before to speak about people's experiences, the, the questions we ask, are asking is really is different than we were asking before. The people's voices, the people who have stood up to be the voices for marginalized communities and the outdoors has, has grown tremendously.
Christine: I know this is something that you and I have talked about as well as being really passionate about trying to figure out who those people are and give them a space to be able to share their experience because like you said, it, it, It doesn't really necessarily do any good for us to tell their story, but to get them in a place where they're the ones actually creating the content and the stories that the people that are relating to are looking for.
Christine: And I think that that's really important shift right now as well.
Sharon: Yeah, no, it's so true. And as you were saying that my mind was going towards our editorial process, right? Like something that we got. I don't know if it was feedback or just something that we're mindful of. If you know, you hire a more diverse writer, it's oftentimes, you know, writing gets edited. There's a process.
Sharon: You send it to an editor and they edit it. Well, if our staff isn't diverse and we just have sort of homogenous, you know, white editors, they're then editing the voice of the writer that you've like hired by design to share their authentic and unique voice. And so we've had to be, of course, we should be hiring more diverse for all of our roles.
Sharon: But that's an interesting thing that you don't necessarily think about and it's behind the scenes, but it's so relevant, right? And so one of the things that we did do when we were bringing all of outside together, outside used to be based in Santa Fe, and there is still a small group of people down there, but we really are a global organization.
Sharon: Now we're about 400 people. Mostly domestic and in Canada and then some in Europe and other English speaking countries, but we very much, while we have an office in Colorado, went to remote workforce because we were able to hire not only more diverse, but just open up our pool of candidates to hire different talent in different places because Boulder and Denver is not cheap to live in.
Sharon: And we just really wanted to have, you know, a unique perspective, which also lends itself to More travel content. Cause we do have writers everywhere. So that's been a, it's been a really nice element of sort of what we're building here at outside.
Christine: Yeah one of the things when we first talked and we were talking about the intersection of travel and outdoors and it was the simplest statement and the most obvious statement and then I, and one that I had thought, why had that never crossed my mind, but you had already said it today, you know, that to go do these activities, we're traveling.
Christine: And I think That somehow gets missed sometimes when you're thinking about the intersection of outdoors, like they're, the skiing is already happening on the mountain, you're not thinking about that not everybody who's skiing at Vail lives in Colorado or, you know, everyone skiing at Big Sky doesn't live in Montana, people are having these lifelong or maybe, you know, once in a lifetime experiences to get there and, you know, all around the world, there's so many incredible outdoors experiences.
Christine: that people participate in and travel is very much a part of how they get there. And so I think it's really important to start merging these communities or thinking of them as already merged communities. And at another industry event, they were also trying to talk about you know outdoor apparel providers and how to make them more a part of the industry.
Christine: And it was another one of those things where I was like, they aren't a part of the industry or how are we segmented? But again, I think it's the perceptions of things. And so it's very interesting when you start looking at how pieces fit together and then questioning how they didn't fit together in the first place that you start actually expanding all of these different conversations and how you can unite things and work.
Christine: And again, it's in an, in its own way, it's kind of inclusivity, right? Is if we are like one domain, we can work together to create such a bigger impact than if we're trying to create an identity of I'm working in the outdoor industry and I work in the tourism industry. If we just are working as a community that wants people to engage with nature, to have well being, to have maybe mindful travel experiences, to have sustainable travel experiences, and not segregate the activity from how we got there I think it's a really interesting shift, and And when you're looking at that for the content you create, do you find that it always like flows naturally to bring those two spaces together?
Christine: Or sometimes do you have to, I guess, walk people through that or bridge that gap?
Sharon: that's a great question. I'm not an editor, so I'm probably not thinking about it through the same lens as like an editor would. But I think, you know, as we were talking about that previously in here, You know, to your point about people that are skiing at Vail or, and maybe don't live there in the ATTA research shows this, our research shows this that like most people's travel is within 100 miles of their home.
Sharon: Right? And so while. You know, when we think of adventure travel, you think of, you know, the Himalaya and Nepal, and you think of going on a safari. And those are absolutely amazing and bucket list dream trips. And some people are privileged or lucky enough to do that every year, or maybe every two or three years, but most people are recreating adventure.
Sharon: So if you're adventuring and you consider travel if it's 100 miles right or more away, that's what most people are doing. And even within the state of Colorado where I live, you know, and you probably see this in your, your states that your listeners live in too. A lot is focused on getting folks that maybe live in the front range up to the mountains, right?
Sharon: So a lot of these different communities spend a lot of time and money trying to draw those of us down here to come up and stay a night, right? At their hotel. And that's all adventure travel, but we just have in our mind that it is, you know, to go to other parts of the world. And most people, you know, might get one trip like that in a lifetime or they save and they do it every few years.
Sharon: And so I think that's where that. You know, reframing our mindset about what adventure travel is and how adventure and the outdoors is kind of right in your backyard. And, you know, to your point, just reframing it and that we're kind of all connected within the industry, both travel and the outdoors and how we can help and grow with each other.
Christine: Well, I think too, that that is one thing that really makes travel accessible. And this is a lot of conversations that came up during the pandemic, because obviously we weren't traveling as much. had in the past, and so people were looking for those adventures in the back door out the back door. And like, It might be impossible for you to take that trip to Nepal, but it might not be impossible for you to go to Evergreen for the weekend from Denver for people listening, you know, and so it allows again, it allows people to be a part of this experience that we're trying to have them be a part of by including that type of travel into What we understand to be travel.
Christine: And I also think when you look at the understanding the financial impact and the economic benefit of travel locally to is shifting. What we think is travel because there are so many things like people traveling for sporting events or traveling for, you know, ski competitions like sometimes that doesn't get put into the bucket of travel from a consumer perspective, but from an industry perspective or economic perspective, it's a part of that metric.
Christine: And so again, it's just kind of Reframing how we view it as an industry, but then also how we view it as travelers and to feel like, yes, I'm an adventure traveler. If I went hiking one hour from my house this weekend, like I am, that's who I am. And I don't, I don't need to create this persona of adventure traveler only by having these grandiose experiences.
Christine: Which I think it will be a great time to kind of talk more now about Outside Festival, which is at the event, what you were sharing with us you know, coming here to Denver in just a couple weeks, which is exciting. This was the, the relevancy that we were talking about. And for me, it was really exciting because the premise, you know, is not only bringing diverse voices to Denver and talking about travel and outdoors experiences, which I think is so exciting.
Christine: And I can't wait to talk about that because that's what I'm like going to be headed to the event for. But also really just bringing people in Denver and people coming to the space to hear about like, what is right outside of your door? How do we get you there? How do we create accessibility? How do we create possibility?
Christine: So I want to talk to you about Outside Festival start to tell our listeners what that is and why it's so important especially right now.
Sharon: Yeah, absolutely. I have so much to say about it. So we can just, I'm happy to answer any questions that you have, but let me give you a quick overview of our vision and hope for this event. So it's called the Outside Festival and it is coming to Denver on June 1st and 2nd, which is just a couple of weeks away.
Sharon: Our vision behind this event is really to create the South by Southwest for the outdoor industry. Right. And you know, if you really kind of think of a bullseye or a map right in the middle of. Striking the balance between education and entertainment, right? Like there's so many trade shows and so many conferences that businesses are just moving away from because they can do business in different ways, or they're not necessarily having to travel.
Sharon: And we know that people want to reach the consumer. And then we know that people want to get outdoors. Music festivals are growing in popularity. And then I think, you know, what South by Southwest has done so well is to create that intersection, of course, between the entertainment aspect and education, but also it's a consumer event, but you sort of have this underlying foundation of the industry and that there will be like minded industry professionals there that will, you know, maybe grab a drink with while you're listening to the concert and, you know, Maybe some business will get done, but maybe it won't.
Sharon: But that those industry professionals, or maybe it's a client, you know, we'll remember that moment. And it's just a much funner way, I guess, to do business, if you will. You know, I think that's one thing that I love about working in industry. I go for a run with my clients, or we took a client many years ago into the grand Canyon.
Sharon: Like who can. Say that they have that opportunity, but it's those moments that people yearn for and look forward to. And it's just a much more fun way to do business. So it's not a trade show. It's not a business conference, but I think it will serve that purpose over time for the outdoor, the travel, the health and wellness.
Sharon: Industry. One of the things that we've been highly focused on is. Drawing in different consumers, because while it is in Denver and we have the mountains that are back door, there's many people that look at those mountains every day, but never go again, as our mission outside is to get more people outdoors.
Sharon: We want to expose them to you know, of course, the festival is outdoors. It can't be in a conference center. We're gonna have amazing weather that weekend, so hopefully that will be in our favor. But just come to the park and enjoy some music and we'll have rock climbing walls. We'll have various experiences that you can just participate in throughout the day and maybe get on a climbing wall.
Sharon: You know, don't, doesn't mean you have to go out and climb in the mountains of Colorado. So, really excited about what we're doing. It's a, it's a deep, deep partnership with the state of Colorado as they really want to plant the flag as sort of the adventure Mecca of the country, which, you know, seems, you know, obvious to those of us that live here or dream to come to Colorado, but it's a big priority for the state.
Sharon: And then lastly, I'll mention before we maybe dive into some questions, the, we've intentionally made kids 12 and under free. So we want this to not be cost prohibitive to families of four or more that can get really expensive to take families to the zoo or to other places. So kids 12 and under are free.
Sharon: And then the ticket price is very affordable. So for a single day ticket you know, starting it, they started at 39 in our early bird pricing. I mean, we have Grammy winning, Grammy nominated artists with us, but like Thundercat and Fleet Foxes, you know, you can't buy a ticket to any one of those artists for that price, and so we intentionally made it.
Sharon: Affordable. And we have been giving away a considerable amount of tickets to, to different marginalized communities, the Denver Public School system, a lot of the tribal areas we've been working with really to just draw a diverse group of people in and get people that maybe don't experience the Colorado outdoors like you think they might.
Christine: Yeah, because just because you live in Colorado doesn't mean you spend all of your time in the mountains, which, you know, I, I grew up in Montana. Also, that doesn't mean I spent all my time in the mountains, but I did live right near Glacier and I did spend a lot of time outdoors, but I just thought simply by being in Denver that that would be what it my lifestyle looked like, and it doesn't for sure.
Christine: It's I don't know why it was surprising to me, but it, it takes effort, right? You actually have to go there. They don't just like walk up to you and, and ask to, to be engaged in nature. So I think it's really important to talk about what that means to, to be outside. And there's, So many reasons and we could go into some of that I'm sure but you know, it's economic barriers.
Christine: It's skill barriers It's just the comfort like Denver is a city So you you have this dichotomy of like you have very city people who happen to live near the mountains So again, it's like trying to figure out how to merge those And I love that the festival kind of feels like it's creating that space where like, if your thing is film and you're or your thing is music, like, you'll go there, but then you're going to have this introduction to maybe you'll hear Sean White's voice.
Christine: Oh my gosh, I didn't know that was something I'd be really excited about or the, the ideas category is my very favorite one. I mean, you have some really great people coming in to, I think, be catalysts for really powerful conversation. And I would love to talk to you about that. Like, why did you decide?
Christine: I know that's a little bit of the South by Southwest idea, but to bring in these types of conversations into this space,
Sharon: Yeah, it's a great question. I think, yeah, it does sort of root itself and, you know, again, kind of the vision of South by Southwest. But you know, we have a whole film and ideas track, which is exactly what it sounds like. The event itself is happening, happening at civic center park right downtown in the heartbeat of Denver.
Sharon: And then the Denver art museum, who is just a fabulous partner of ours is right adjacent to the park and is hosting our film and ideas summit. Throughout the weekend. And so we have just such an incredible lineup of speakers. You can go to theoutsidefestival. com to take a look at that. And you know, you have to sign up for our speaking engagement as well as film because the Denver Art Museum does only have so much space, but there should be plenty of room for everybody.
Sharon: But this is really where that sort of education and inspiration moment comes from. You mentioned Sean White. We have Quanah Chasing Horse, who is just doing some amazing climate activation work right now. You know, we've got Dhani Jones and we've got Scott Lehman and Shana Unger who are doing, they're Deaf Mountaineers, and have just done some really amazing, amazing work in that category.
Sharon: So there's just a lot of great conversations that I think are going to be happening. And then of course, A whole, we've basically curated an entire film festival throughout the weekend. We were very mindful of the films that we chose. We had sort of an overarching theme of diversity and inclusion through that.
Sharon: Whether You had talent in the film, or it was a more diverse filmmaker or producer. But some of the films that we have are just unbelievable. Some award winning films. They've also only been out within a year. So it's chances are you probably haven't seen them. These are not films that have been in the film circuit.
Sharon: For, for many years. So you know, all weekend long, kind of one o'clock to six or seven p. m. You can go walk across the street, catch a film, catch a speaker, and then walk, you know, back across the street and have a drink and enjoy the music or, you know, engage in any of our, you know, five or six different experiences that we have.
Sharon: But I think that those conversations that are going to happen in those rooms at DAM. Are the things that move the needle for the industry and move the needle for people to see themselves in the outdoors that maybe don't already. So that's what I'm really hopeful for with that
Christine: Yeah, I, I think that it's really exciting. And, you know, you mentioned the idea of this, there being industry people here as well as consumers. And there is an event happening before the outside festival. That is the, the summit that's for outdoor industry leaders. So when you say that they like, they will be here.
Christine: So it's not just a hypothetical. This could happen, but I think. That's, you know, when you talk about moving the needle is like you're gathering people, you're gathering them in a space that they probably really feel more comfortable working and in travel and tourism and outdoors. Like this is a space that we feel vibrant in.
Christine: And then you add this level of conversation, you create community, like, I really think that is this space where innovation happens. And so for me, that's when you were talking about it, where I was thinking, gosh, this is such a powerful container for possibility of what might happen and, and to see this event eventually evolve as you see, like, where the things that are really impactful happened, where the things that people were really engaged, you know, where that landed, and you can continue to add entertainment and education, but also really support that innovation and that inclusivity that it's really meant to foster.
Sharon: Yeah, you mentioned the industry day on the Friday when we 1st imagined this. Event, the outside festival, we always had in the back of our mind that the industry was sort of be the undercurrent or like the heartbeat, right. Of everything that we're doing. And we thought, well, maybe let's not bite off more than we can chew in year one.
Sharon: And we'll add some more core industry moments as we build, you know, in year two or three, but we had so much interest to do that in year one. So we decided why not, like, let's just make it happen. And so we added a third day, which is on Friday, the 31st. And that is really more of your traditional conference style, although we've intentionally designed.
Sharon: All of our meals to be networking moments outdoors. So you're not sitting at an eight by, you know, eight round table and, you know, just hour after hour of conference rooms and whatnot. But we've really designed that day to be for industry professionals or folks that maybe want to get into the industry.
Sharon: And we're going to have a really amazing day of five different panels that really cover all of those topics like inclusivity, sustainability and climate. We have an amazing lineup of panelists for to go over policy, and this one's a little bit more about the outdoor recreation economy in Colorado.
Sharon: But it's really. It's really amazing leaders like Senator Hickenlooper, who is such an advocate for outdoor recreation and those that believe that it can truly change the world. And that, I mean, the outdoor recreation economy is a trillion dollar industry, but it doesn't ever get acknowledged as as big as it is.
Sharon: And so we have a lot of policy leaders that are going to be talking us through the economy of the outdoor industry. We have an incredible women's panel lined up, and then I'm going to be moderating a marketing and creativity. Panel about social media. We'll wrap up that day with a happy hour, just again, for some more networking, and then that'll really roll us in to the weekend.
Sharon: So we're really excited about that. Tickets are still for sale on that. That is a smaller group of people. We are expecting roughly 20, 000 people over the course of the entire weekend and our capacity on Friday is 500, I should mention too, that on Friday, we're doing something and again, to, you know, through this lens of wanting To grow the industry and make it more accessible from 4 to 6 PM on Friday afternoon, we also have a hiring fair.
Sharon: So we have partnered with base camp outdoors. They have a really amazing community of outdoor interested professionals or outdoor professionals through Facebook and some of the other social channels, and they put on these various gather events in various cities. And we've got over 30 tables of companies outside is going to be there that have open jobs right now in their companies.
Sharon: It's completely free. Come meet with some of those recruiters and learn more about their companies and just network with the outdoor industry. So that's happening right now. From four to six on Friday afternoon at the McNichols building right there in civic center park. No purchase needed.
Christine: Yeah. Great. Thank you for mentioning that. Cause you know, that is definitely people that listening are always wondering how to get into the industry and even where to look or what would be a good fit or just curious about how to open that door. And again, I, I think this is such a cool thing to add to this because you already have people that are coming here thinking about it and this just gives them another opportunity.
Christine: access point in that you wouldn't expect in an event like this. The other thing that I wanted to go back and touch on obviously I'm super passionate about creating a voice, a space for the voices of women in the industry. The event that we were at in Denver, there were so many women there, which I was very excited about.
Christine: I think it might've been like 50, 50 in that room, which For me was really after being in the industry so long. I was just really excited to see that in that moment. And then to see your panel on female industry leaders. Why did you feel that was important to create that space? Because it's not always, you know, always a major part of outdoor and adventure spaces.
Sharon: Yeah, no, it's absolutely true. I personally have such a soft spot in my heart for mentoring and leading women. I'm the executive sponsor for the women's ERG here at outside. And I have had some amazing female mentors. I have mentored some amazing women, both outside and within the industry and the outdoor industry at large is Predominantly male white male, and, you know, obviously the work that we're doing across, you know, a broader array of diversity, but women especially not better or, but just as a lane within the industry is something that we're really excited to focus on.
Sharon: And so, yeah, we have an incredible lineup throughout the weekend of female leaders, female athletes doing amazing things. And then at the summit we also have an incredible panel titled when you bring outside women and that when women support women, that we all win. And so Mel strong, who is going to be moderating that panel, she's the founding partner at next ventures.
Sharon: And then we've got athletes like Rebecca rush and the global CMO, Sophie Bambach of the North face and some other professional athletes. Susan Viscont, who oversees REI path ahead ventures, which is really focused on bringing. Smaller brands and like founders and startup level of brands into the outdoor industry.
Sharon: So REI has done just some amazing work in that space. And so I think that'll be a really fun conversation as well. I should also mention that some of this content is going to be recorded and captured, of course, As a content organization, we produce a lot of content and we push it out there. So if folks are not able to make it to the event we will be sharing some of that content after through our channels.
Sharon: So look for that in the coming weeks after the festival too.
Christine: Yeah, thank you. I wanted to touch back on mentoring. I am. I think that's something that's really, really important. It's something that in my career when I started, I really wanted to seek out those voices or I found myself really drawn to the voices that were already being elevated in a professional context.
Christine: And you know, just kept trying to get myself as close to them as possible. And again, the dynamic was very different 25 years ago than it is today. But still. I think it's so important to be aligned with other women. And then now really to kind of flip it and reach out to women starting in the industry.
Christine: Or also that's why this podcast is so important. I think people, you know, they hear someone else's story, they see what their journey looked like, they can then envision themselves on that path. So in an, in a way, I feel like these conversations kind of create that. a space of mentoring and holding space for other women.
Christine: But why has that been so significant to you in your own journey? And then also, as you said, you know, kind of reaching back and mentoring women coming up through the industry now.
Sharon: Yeah, I have had just some incredible women, either formal mentors, informal mentors. I've had one female boss in my career and I will say I've had some amazing male bosses that hit and mentors that have also. Definitely laid a strong foundation for my career. But one in particular female that was like my boss, right.
Sharon: Starting out in my career when I was first living in Colorado Springs, right out of college. I was a junior sales rep at a cycling company and she was my boss and she was, she was sort of the tough love boss, but I, you know, it, I always had tough skin. I went into sales for a reason and, you know, I can have the door slammed in my face, but she, Just taught me so much and she's, she's 15 years older than I am, but we are to this day, best friends.
Sharon: Like we travel together. She was in my wedding and you, that's kind of unusual maybe to build both a friendship and a professional level mentorship in that way. But I still, to this day, call her for career advice or life advice. And it's interesting because I have been mentoring a gal. It outside through a formal mentor mentee program that we have it outside.
Sharon: And while the formality of it has ended, we, she now works for me. She didn't, she was in a different department. And I scooped her up and pulled her into my division. And she's about 15 years younger than me. And I just see, and we've become both dear friends and she comes to me for advice and I actually learned so much from her.
Sharon: And I think it's really important for a lot of times people think about men, mentors and mentees, that the mentee is learning everything. Right. And that's certainly true. Like, I think that there's a lot of that, but there's so much that Mentors can learn from their younger mentees, like the generations coming up or the future of our industry and the future of our workforce.
Sharon: And so I just really love working with younger women that are really rising to their career. You know, going forward. I've had mentors say, I want to, you know, be at this salary by the time I hit 30. And then when they do it, it's just such an amazing, you know, thing to celebrate with them or, you know, whatever that milestone is for them.
Sharon: And you can see yourself 10 years ago or 15 years ago and think about who helped you get along that way. So I just think, you know, oftentimes women can. It can be perceived as we're clicky or we're competitive and you certainly still have some of that. But I think if women support women, much like our panel is going to talk about, we all win.
Sharon: I just think that there's so much power in that and it's just, I think women are going to rule the world one day. I hope so. Anyways, in our lifetime.
Christine: Me too. But that will be a whole nother conversation that we won't have right now, but I'm glad that we could have it some other day. I, I think the, the other thing that I really appreciate in, in that is maybe Some of the the workplace dynamic because I think for so long especially, you know when we started that level of professionalism was so important right because you did not want to be thought of as Someone who had emotions, who had connections, who had friends, who had any, like, you know, it was, it was very business.
Christine: And I think, I, you know, I joke with some of my, the people that I work with, either that consult with me or work with me, we'll be getting off Zoom and off, my favorite thing is like, okay, I love you. Bye. And I was like, wait, that's probably weird. But then I was like, what if that wasn't weird? What if we actually got to surround ourselves with, by, you know, with women that and employees that we really care for and care about, and that we don't have to be stony and And like so competitive and so rigid like there's that level of connection actually might build the next best thing.
Christine: And you know, I, I bring people on who believe so much in what I'm doing to amplify the voices of women. That they're there because of love. Like they really do love the mission. And so it's a different paradigm and a different way of thinking about corporate culture. And so I think it's really important that you actually can be friends.
Christine: with people that you work with. And not just be friendly, but actually really be invested in their career and their lives. Like, I feel like that, that forced separation kept us from being a human at work. And when you can like fully be, Human and be your whole self at work, you actually might be more productive and creative.
Christine: And if you have a meltdown over something, whether it's personal or professional, and you have someone you can reach out to right there and say, Hey, I need you for five minutes, and then you get right back into the flow of your work. You have such. A richer balance in your daily routine and I don't know if, if you feel any of that, but, and I don't know if that's something that only women can access.
Christine: I don't have a male perspective because I don't have that. But I, I witnessed that in my colleagues. that have maybe gotten over whatever that was that kept us from only kept us having like the masculine energy and not bringing any of our feminine energy into the workspace. I guess this may be a real simplified way to say it.
Sharon: I think that is a simplified way to say it. And I think it's really important. In fact, in our recent is maybe 8 weeks ago or so we do monthly women's like as a part of our ERG meetings. And a lot of times it's, you know, we come together and we have a topic and there might be 5 or there might be 15 people there.
Sharon: But we hosted a company wide lunch and learn where we did a panel that I moderated with a handful of women in the organization at all different levels. And we invited men onto the panel as well, because it is about how men interact with women and how men support women in their careers. And it was such a fun and enriching dynamic conversation, but we ended up spending a lot of time on that exact topic about how.
Sharon: You know, the perception of if women are aggressive or assertive that they, you know, if men are that way, like they get elevated or they, you know, it's not look down upon if they are outspoken, but I'm a pretty assertive person and I've definitely learned, you know, one of my favorite podcasts is radical candor.
Sharon: And I've learned that over the years and it's served me well, but it also can backfire on women in a way that it doesn't on men and it shouldn't. Right. And so I think that Female energy, female I want to say emotion, but like we bring a different level of empathy. We bring a different level of perspective, whether it be to the boardroom or just a meeting.
Sharon: And it's so imperative to have at the table. And we shouldn't be sorry for it. It should be A healthy ecosystem where all of those different personality types and perspectives are welcomed, but it is a definitely a very tricky balance. And I think through that sort of mentor mentee ship lens, you know, younger women, you know, like I've learned candor over my career because I've had to use it with, you know more senior level leadership or, you know, just in my business conversations, but, you know, Younger women that are just starting out in their career, maybe don't, and they kind of are more reserved.
Sharon: And I think they can learn by watching, right. And learn by of course, more formal mentorship. I just think it's such an important that is a really challenging element of navigating in the workplace, but it does feel like a shift is happening. And I hope that only continues.
Christine: Yeah. And I think it really is important as as important of bringing men into the conversation about how to support women in achieving More in within their careers is that men need that space as well, because some men also have more creative energy or more feminine energy. And if that stifled because they're trying to hold themselves up to some level of expectation, we also don't get the best of their performance at work.
Christine: And so I think, you know, it's not just a one sided conversation. And as you were just speaking, you reminded of me of conversation I had with my daughter yesterday, who's, um, she's eight and she said, Mom, I'm not sure if at school today I had a brag or if it was like a humble brag and it was okay. And so I was like, well, one, I don't know how you know the, the language around a humble brag versus a brag, but that's really exciting.
Christine: And two, I was like, why couldn't you brag about yourself or what were you sharing that felt like. It needed to be a humble brag instead of a brag, but it just was interesting that, you know, already at that age, she's questioning how much she can assert what her value is or what she did that was significant or important that she's already questioning if it's okay to be outspoken.
Sharon: Yeah, it's so interesting. I have an eight year old too, and I'm tall. I'm 5'10 and my daughter is 99 percentile. She is so tall, and I always loved being tall. And I, I'm her hype woman. I am like, you are the tallest in your class. That is going to serve you well. And I want her to have that confidence. And similarly to your conversation, every time they come home and, Whether it's a good grade, or they did well on a test, like, the first thing I ask them is, are you proud of yourself?
Sharon: Because I want them to feel proud of that, and like, acknowledge that they're proud of themselves for what they accomplished, and that, whether that's bragging or humble brag or like, It continues to instill confidence and I do with my son as well, right? But who's a little bit more shy and reserved and maybe needs some of that confidence boosting.
Sharon: But I think it's so important and to your point, it's so interesting that young girls that eight are already feeling like they might not be able to state that they're proud of themselves or, you know, own that brag. So,
Christine: Yeah. It just says that we probably still have a work to do, but that there's awareness there already feels like that means there is a shift, right? And I love that the the height that you added that because it's something I'm also 5'10 and it was something I was so proud of for so long, but then there was also those moments where like when you feel like you're supposed to be invisible that you, you can't be, you're like, I cannot be less than the five, 10 of myself standing here in this room right now.
Christine: And this could also probably be a whole nother conversation, but it's, it's a real, it's a real part of my experience of how I try to figure out what I'm supposed to show up like in a room. Like, am I, am I supposed to be this person that takes up this much space or am I supposed to be invisible? And I, and I, It's very hard to sometimes navigate it because I, it's just nearly impossible to disappear in many spaces.
Christine: And so I think it's really interesting that we even have to be thinking about that for our, our daughters that are coming behind us, because my oldest is 14 and she's probably one inch shorter than me. And she has bright, bright, like blazing auburn hair, so there's just no way she's not disappearing and I'm like, I feel like the universe is teaching me something through her experience coming up behind me because she takes up her space and it's beautiful to see but I'm, I'm really grateful to have this conversation with you and to talk about, you know, the way that we can bring it.
Christine: more voices into the industry that we can talk about accessibility that we can talk about, you know, owning our voice and our power in and holding space. I think all these things are really, really important. Before we go, I do have a few rapid fire questions that I wanted to have to get to, and then we'll tell our listeners one more time where they can find out about.
Christine: the festival if they want to join us. The first question is what are you reading right now?
Sharon: Oh, good question. I cannot put it down. I'm reading Brittany Griner's book. I'm coming home. I went to Baylor. I'm a graduate of Baylor. Brittany was a few years after me, but just an amazing female basketball star. Most people know that she was detained in Russia for a number of years and it's been home for about a year and her book just came out.
Sharon: I preordered it and I just think she's so amazing what she went through. And then also an amazing athlete. Also very timely because what's happening in the women's NBA and pay equity and with Caitlin Clark, it's just been a fascinating read. I am staying up to like 11 o'clock every night trying to finish that book.
Sharon: It's, It's a good one.
Christine: Yeah, thank you. What, we didn't talk a lot about travel in the end in this conversation, but what is always in your suitcase when you travel?
Sharon: Oh, good question. Always my Kindle. I'm an avid reader. And one of the things I try to do, I travel quite a bit alone, both for work and by myself. And I, one of my, it's not maybe a hard rule, but it's something that I try to do is kind of turn off the screens. Like don't doom scroll on my phone. When I'm laying in bed at night not to watch shows, I really try to read a lot.
Sharon: So I don't really leave it really anywhere. I always have it in my purse too without my Kindle.
Christine: To sojourn is to travel somewhere as if you live there for a short while. Where is someplace that you would still love to sojourn?
Sharon: Oh, Japan. I lived in Japan when I was a child. I was five and came home when I was seven and I just, I have a longing to go back. I haven't been back. It's just such an amazing culture. And so if I could expat in Japan for a few years, I would, I would love to do that.
Christine: What is something you eat that immediately connects you to a place that you've been?
Sharon: Ooh, that's a good one. I just had sushi last night, so that makes me think of Japan. That's probably, I don't often think of that when I'm eating sushi, because I eat a lot of sushi. Croissants. I've traveled Europe a lot, and I, it's not, that is not something I eat often. I'm a pretty healthy eater and very active.
Sharon: But I cannot pass up an amazing croissant, and it makes me think of my husband and I's first trip to to Italy, when we, when we first got married.
Christine: Who was a person that inspired or encouraged you to set out and travel?
Sharon: Hmm. I would say my, my, my parents, right? Cause they definitely inspired that in me and moving around. So I think I'll stick with that one. I'm sure there are other folks that have inspired me to travel, but I'm thankful that my parents gave us that opportunity. All through my life.
Christine: If you could take an adventure with one person, fictional or real, alive or past, who would it be?
Sharon: You know, I, my dad passed in 2020. And while that might sound a little cliche, I would, I would travel one on one with him. He all, him and my mom always traveled after us kids left the house and he and my mom never made it to Greece. I had to cancel a couple trips. Cause he had an injury and. And then he passed a bit unexpectedly.
Sharon: One place he always wanted to go was South Africa. And we always talked about, cause my mom had zero interest in that. And he and I always kind of talked about, let's do it together. And unfortunately we never had the chance. So I would, I think that's what it would be.
Christine: Yeah, thank you so much for sharing that. The last question Soul of Travel is a place for recognizing women in the industry we admire. Who is someone that you would like to honor in this space? Soul
Sharon: Yeah, someone. She's not exactly in the industry, but someone that I've had, I've known for 20 years, but have really intersected back into getting to know her in a different way in the past couple of years. It's a gal named Robin O'Brien. If you Google her, her name will come right up. She actually spends a lot more time.
Sharon: In the food space. I just went to a really powerful women's event this past week called women in food and finance. And so she's kind of spent her time in that space. She's often known as like the Aaron Brockovich of food, but the reason it does intersect and why it's come to mind that only because it's been.
Sharon: Top of mind, but she's got four kids that are now in or out of college and she's just a powerhouse of a mom. And in the industry or in the business sector, but also we've been talking a lot about how food really intersects more with the outdoors, whether it's the land that you're in the soil that you're growing your food in.
Sharon: And that's a goal of ours at the outside. Festival in years to come is how do we really pull more farmers in and pull more folks in that are, that are building a business out of land. And so I haven't spent a lot of time in the food industry, but I'm learning through her. And I just have been so impressed with her in recent weeks and months.
Sharon: So she's the one that comes to mind and you should definitely check out the books that she's written or some of her Ted talks because she's pretty incredible.
Christine: Thank you so much for for mentioning that. I always love. I feel like travel is a little bit of everywhere, so it touches on everything. So I think it's great to hear that. Well, thank you so much for for being here and for this conversation. I'm so excited for the event again. People can still get tickets for that, and we'll look forward to bumping into you at the event soon.
Sharon: Yeah. I can't wait. Coming right up. Hope to see you there.
Christine: Thank you.
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