Episode 199 - Lila Fox, Lila Fox Travel Co.
In this episode of Soul of Travel, Season 6: Women's Wisdom + Mindful Travel, presented by @journeywoman_original, Christine shares a soulful conversation with Lila Fox.
Lila is a Louisiana native and former Civil & Environmental Engineer turned internationally recognized travel consultant after parlaying her love of travel writing into travel planning in 2012. Since then, she has intentionally built a loyal client list, as well as an extensive network of deep relationships within certain niches of the travel industry. Lila predominantly arranges leisure travel and is known for customizing immersive ‘country and town’ experiences around the world, preferring to get travelers out of over visited places and into often overlooked sections of countries via car / private driver / private boat / or train, where real tradition & culture can still be felt.
As a lifelong learner, she enjoys creating black-and-white photographs of the people & animals she meets during her travels. She also holds certification in Nutrition & Wellness Counseling and is a Yoga Alliance 300hr+ Certified Yoga Instructor with a specialty in Yin Yoga. As matters of personal passion more than anything, Lila will often meet up with local artists and interesting photographers in the places she visits and weave that in with connecting with local wellness experts to learn from their practices, and vice versa. Her travel advice has been published in such periodicals as The New York Times and National Geographic Adventure, and she has been named an industry Trendsetter by Luxury Travel Advisor Magazine as well as one of the South’s most stylish by Southern Living magazine. She used to have a personal brand and social media presence. These days Lila prefers a more simple, quiet mode of existence and work. When not out on the road (India, Mexico, England, Oman are favorites), a tiny mountain town in Colorado is where you’ll find her.
Lila’s Transition from Engineer to Travel Advisor: Creating a Life and Career on Your Own Terms
Lila Fox's journey began in the often rigid world of engineering. Despite her success, Lila realized early on that her career path was driven by the desire for financial security rather than a genuine passion for engineering. "It wasn't a love of engineering," Lila reflects; instead, she found the love of math and science through the practical choice and knowing that this field would always provide a means of supporting herself – and had the added bonus of being able to work from anywhere in the world.
Over time, as Lila navigated the corporate ladder, she realized that upward progression in her field did not excite her. She turned to creative outlets like writing and photography to deal with her burnout…until she realized how much she loved the experience of this new interaction with life.
Her blog, which began as a personal haven, inadvertently opened the door to new opportunities. Embracing her love for travel, she transitioned from engineering to become a travel advisor, creating a life and career aligned with her true interests and passions: her love of storytelling and exploration.
Photo by Lila Fox
Deciding How to Grow or Flow in Your Business
Success, Lila argues, wears many faces. For her, it's about finding a model of operation that resonates personally rather than conforming to the industry's standard measures of success.
Lila's approach is clear: rather than adhering to prescriptive definitions of success, one should define what success means on their terms. "It's basic—what do you need in your household?" she asks, suggesting that personal goals and needs should guide professional trajectories.
As Lila describes her career journey, she emphasizes the significance of balance and boundaries. Despite her enthusiasm for mentoring, she acknowledges the limits of her capacity, advocating for alternative methods of mentorship through books and inspiring stories of others.
Christine and Lila also touch on the importance of scheduling time for personal well-being. Christine notes that prioritizing wellness should not be optional, even if it's challenging to maintain consistently. This perspective on self-care is vital, especially for those who, like Lila, juggle multiple roles and responsibilities. (Tune in for insights into how social media plays such a vital role in self-care and boundary-setting.)
Lila’s insights encourage us all to pursue paths that nurture our passions, define success on our terms, and prioritize personal well-being in the process. Her story is a reminder that we are all architects of our journeys, and the journey itself is where the real magic lies.
“Well-being and health and balance and joy just go hand in hand with business success to me. If you have a healthy body, if you have a healthy mind, if you’re confident, you’re going to be better in business.”
Soul of Travel Episode 199 At a Glance
In this conversation, Christine and Lila discuss:
· Lila’s transition from engineer to travel advisor
· Creating a life and career on your own terms
· Deciding how to grow or flow in your business
· Setting boundaries and prioritizing personal well-being
Join Christine and Lila Fox now for this soulful conversation.
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Related UN Sustainable Development Goals
Sustainable Development Goal #3: Ensure healthy lives and promote well-being for all at all ages.
Sustainable Development Goal #4: Ensure inclusive and equitable quality education and promote lifelong learning opportunities for all.
Sustainable Development Goal #12: Ensure sustainable consumption and production patterns.
Resources & Links Mentioned in the Episode
Visit https://www.lilafox.co/ to learn more, or connect with Lila on LinkedIn.
About the Soul Of Travel Podcast
Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of people making a positive impact in the tourism industry. In each episode, you’ll hear the stories of women who are industry professionals, seasoned travelers, and community leaders. Our expert guests represent social impact organizations, adventure-based community organizations, travel photography and videography, and entrepreneurs who know that travel is an opportunity for personal awareness and a vehicle for global change.
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We are thought leaders, action-takers, and heart-centered change-makers who inspire and create community. Join host Christine Winebrenner Irick for these soulful conversations with our global community of travelers exploring the heart, the mind, and the globe.
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Soul of Travel Episode 199Transcript
Women’s travel, transformational travel, sustainable travel, women leaders in travel, social entrepreneurship
Christine: Welcome to soul of travel podcast. I'm Christine. And today I'm really excited to be joined by Lila Fox, who is the owner of Lila Fox travel. Um, this is going to be a little bit of a different conversation that I've had with some past guests, but there'll be some similarities as well. So I'm, I'm really excited to get going.
Christine: But before we do, Lila, I'm just going to turn it over to you to introduce yourself to my listeners and tell us a little bit about who you are in the space of travel.
Lila: Thanks so much. And thanks for having me on too. I've listened to your podcast for a while. You're kind of like the OG in my mind. So to be asked to be on as is a huge honor. And I'm excited to have this conversation with you. Um, yeah, I've been in travel for about 12 years. It's a second career. Uh, I own a really small travel agency.
Lila: It's just myself. I work with a small group of clients. Um, longstanding. I've worked with many for over a decade. just on their travel anywhere they need to be in the world. And that's kind of the business side. I'm also, um, a certified yoga teacher, a travel photographer, and do a bit of mentoring as well.
Christine: Yeah, thank you for that introduction. And I love, I have written down in my notes, travel, photography, writing, yoga, um, which are all like my very favorite things. And I know that you and I had that opportunity to meet, I feel like it's now at least been a couple of years ago in person, um, for coffee here in Colorado.
Christine: And one of the things that was so great about that conversation is we were both saying, Oh, I'm really bad at. Like chit chat and superficial conversation and we like both warned each other as we sat down and both of our eyes lit up and we're like, aha. And then like within 10 minutes we were like in the weeds of everything.
Christine: I'm sure the people around us were like, what is happening with this conversation? It is all over the place and it's intense and it's like, it was so good. So I appreciate that and I can't wait to bring that into this space.
Lila: Yeah, no, I'm, I am, I'm very open about, I'm just terrible at small talk. Um, but if you want to talk about, Infinity, like I'm all about it, you know?
Christine: Yeah, and not everyone can go there. Although I feel like I tend to find those people now because it's just the energy that I'm putting out there. And so it's great to meet those kindred spirits and be able to, to dive in. Um, well, I want to start, um, you mentioned that this is your second career and you actually began your first career as a teacher.
Christine: As an engineer. So I wanted to talk a little bit about that and then maybe talk about the juxtaposition between that and a lot of the things that you're doing now that are so creative where as I can imagine my husband is an engineer so I can imagine that that career is a little bit more rigid and formal and um, very much follows like the boxes and the systems in place.
Christine: And right now you feel like to me that you're taking apart systems. So it feels very opposite. And I'd love to hear a little bit about that.
Lila: Yeah. I mean, I wouldn't say that I always dreamed to be an engineer. I grew up, I was raised by a single father. We didn't have a lot of money. We didn't have much. And so I kind of knew from a young age, I went to a school. That I later learned that my father petitioned to get me in. We were out of district, but it was a really good school.
Lila: Um, and I grew up around. A lot of money. I, we didn't have a lot of money, but I, all of my friends had had a lot of money. And so I knew the differences really early on, really young. And I just knew from a young age, I love my father. I love where I'm from. I'm very grateful for my upbringing. I knew that I didn't want to worry as an adult.
Lila: Uh, and then the older I got kind of teenage years, I didn't date a lot. I didn't date a lot in college. I was like, I'm probably not ever going to get married. And so I knew that I knew that engineering, I knew that some sort of math tech science degree would always give me options. I would always be able to support myself.
Lila: So I came at it from a way of being able to support myself and be able to go anywhere I want in the world work wise. So it wasn't a love of engineering, actually found the love of math. I found the love of science through doing it, but it was really from a place of wanting to be able to support myself.
Lila: And Being a woman engineer, I said yes to every opportunity. So I went, I went all over with my, with my short, you know, 12, 15 years in engineering, I traveled all the time. I took every role that was presented to me. I flew up the ranks really fast. And I found myself at, you know, in my early thirties.
Lila: Looking at what the next step was in the big corporation that I was working for. I was working for a big environmental company and I looked at the next step up. I was already managing a team of people. I'm not great at managing people. I love mentoring, but I'm not great at managing. I think there's a difference and we can talk about it later, but I looked at what was next and I didn't want it.
Lila: And I was in my early thirties and I was like, how, how can you be in your early thirties? and not really be excited about the progression of your career in the profession that I was in. And because I was traveling so much with work and we were, my husband and I were traveling just because we love travel.
Lila: Uh, I picked up a camera. I started writing. I found, uh, I took writing classes in college, learned how to write. You know, write story properly and then technically properly. And so started writing as just a creative outlet, uh, started taking photos as a creative outlet because I was unhappy and burnout in my career.
Lila: I was working a ton and wasn't happy with it. And so I needed, I needed that balance. So I found it through photography and writing. And at the time I had Facebook account, if I'm not mistaken. And I had a blog when blogs weren't anything. A good girlfriend of mine said, Hey, you should just have a blog. Put, you know, write these stories, put your photography up.
Lila: We want to know what you're doing. Cause I was never home. I was living far away from home. And so I started that blog that way. And in my, you know, in my social circles, no one was really. Doing that at the time, this was probably 2007 timeframe, uh, to 2009, 10, kind of in there. No one was really putting stuff out on the blog.
Lila: Certainly no one in my social circles was traveling. I'm from a really small town in Louisiana. And so it had a way of standing out that I don't know is as easy today. If that makes sense in the sort of social media landscape. And I just made really, really cool connections through photography and writing and that blog, and just kind of, you know, putting stuff out on Facebook to my friends and family.
Lila: And long story short, I got introduced to a gentleman up in Manhattan who had a really small high end agency. And he was like, Hey, let's. Let's partner. Start an LLC. I'll introduce you to people. You have, you have an eye for this. You have the taste, um, and just see what happens. And that's, And I did. I just, I started an LLC in 2012 and send an email out to friends and family like, Hey, you know, you know, I love travel.
Lila: I've been writing about travel. I'm partnered with this really cool company up in Manhattan. I can arrange travel now. And it blew up. I, um, very quickly again, I think it was just the time it was timing. 2012, there wasn't really social media. It was easier to stand out organically. And, um, I remember taking, having to take phone calls in bathroom stalls.
Lila: And that was kind of where I was like, okay, something has to give because this isn't fair. It's not fair to my clients that I want with me forever travel clients. And it's really not unfair to my, to my employer. You know, it's time for me to move on and let someone have that, that spot where I was in engineering.
Christine: Um, wow. Thank you for, for sharing that. And I think it's so interesting. We weren't, I was going to save social media till the end, but we've already, you've already kind of touched on it. So maybe we'll, we'll begin. So I'm going to talk a little bit about the timing of things and how to begin there, but the timing of things, it's really been interesting for me talking to people who have had blogs for a really long time, and that have a huge following because of that, but they have it before social media, which I think so many of us in our businesses now, especially if you've started a business in the last five years or 10 years, like that has been the way that people tell you to start and grow a business.
Christine: And. Um, I have a lot of conflicting feelings about that. And yet that's what's really modeled. And so it's hard to figure out how to go up against that. If you are starting right now, it feels like even bigger hurdle. And all the time I look, try to look back in my career and I remember working, um, one of my first jobs. I worked for Lindblad Expeditions and, um, back then they actually, it was like two name changes, two iterations of their business ago. Um, I remember being in a meeting with them saying, I think we should have a website. And, you know, so I'm like, I've definitely sat in spaces where people were selling travel without Social media without websites, even which at this point seems really highly improbable, but I know that people make it work.
Christine: So, um, I'd love to talk to you about, about that because as you said, you don't have really a social media presence. Is that something that you? Is that you knew about yourself right away? Is it something you maybe never had time to start and then just kept with it? Or what has that, that been like in your own journey to build the relationship that you have without social media?
Lila: Yeah. I love the question. Cause it's. It has, you know, as with most things in life, it's an evolution. I, I, I think it's my, my engineering brain. I think through things for a very long time before I make an ultimate decision. I overanalyze. I don't think that's a bad thing. Um, I also am fully aware that anything in life may work perfectly fine for a period of time.
Lila: And when it no longer does, it's okay to say that. And it's okay to do what's right. For you, you know, for the way that you feel inside. And I, I mean, I loved my blog. I loved Facebook when I was on it until I didn't. Um, and when I was thinking about kind of going. Leaving Facebook behind Instagram was being talked about, especially for photographers and artists and kind of creators.
Lila: And because it was a place where to me, I could just share a photography. And, you know, when I eventually did delete Instagram, I went and, you know, I downloaded all of my photos and I went back and looked at my very first photos and posts and stuff, and it was so innocent and it was, it was, it was truly just to share photography and I followed a lot of photographers and it was.
Lila: Innocence probably the best word and it felt more community, um, versus creator. And I think when, when you saw that switch from community to creator and selling, I wasn't doing it to sell. I was doing it because I loved, I loved photography, but I'm not a professionally trained photographer. I study under photographers and for me, it was just a way to get inspiration, share photography and vice versa.
Lila: But, When, when I saw it switch and I, and I, it was kind of whenever hashtags came about and it just became very apparent to me that the motive, the motive of someone getting in became a little different and my, I just kind of like perked up on it and then it was almost like it happened, it didn't happen overnight, but it, it kind of, in hindsight, it feels like it happened overnight where.
Lila: It became almost unrecognizable. Like at one point you could go in and you could just chronologically see everything. And then over time, that wasn't the case, you know, algorithms took over and became more of a money making thing. And, and the more that we know about what these companies are doing. Um, I always say to young kids, but to, you know, 50 year old women, 60 year old women, 70 year old men, like what it's doing to people in general, in terms of attention.
Lila: And I couldn't, I couldn't give it my time anymore, knowing what I knew about it. And, you know, if you look at what it's doing to young girls, young boys, um, 20 year olds, 25 year olds. I was 40 when I deleted it and I couldn't, I didn't like the way that it made me feel. And I didn't like that so much of my attention was going to it, but I wasn't in control of what my followers, my account was private, my friends, my family, I wasn't in control of what they would see that I would post.
Lila: And I wasn't in control of what I would see a company was. And, you know, it could probably be a totally different conversation, but. I just couldn't have the feelings that I had about it, what it's doing to people, what it's doing to divide societies, what it's doing to divide friends and families and, and, and what it's doing to people's attention and, you know, going to any restaurant, any time of day, any coffee shop, it's incredibly sad to me because I've been removed from it for almost five years now from Instagram, from Facebook, any of it.
Lila: And it's, it's, it's. I know it's not foreign because it's so much a part of modern life in America and in the West, I would say, but I'm probably around the world, but I, it's so alarming and really, really jarring to see like an entire family sitting at a dinner table and not talking and they're in their phones.
Lila: And maybe it's incredibly judgmental, but I also think it plays into so much that is wrong in terms of. Of people feeling like they belong, of loneliness, of, of connection. Yeah, you don't have that. You don't have connection and you have loneliness because you're in here and you're constantly comparing to something else that's fictitious, in my, in my opinion, is fictitious.
Lila: It's incredibly sad. To my eyes, because I've been removed from it for so long, it's really sad to me. To even see two friends sitting at a table having lunch, but they're not talking, like, I guess it's my age too. I'm 46, but I think it's so weird. I just think it's incredibly weird and sad, honestly.
Christine: yeah, I, it's so interesting too, that you mentioned the connection. Because I feel like. When I do put content out for the podcast, for the most part, it's almost just like an extension of my website. It's like, here's information. I it's all just, um, scheduled. Like I don't look at it. It's just a way that if people were looking, they might find me there.
Christine: Probably they don't because I don't study hashtags and algorithms and all that stuff. It's one of those things that feels like a should on my list, on my Lotus Sojourns page. And my personal page, like, I definitely agree this idea of, like, what it looked like then and now is very different, and I hadn't thought about that for a really long time.
Christine: That gives me a lot of clarity about how easy it might be able to say no. There's other things in there for me that have left me hanging on because there is some connection with people that I know I would lose track of otherwise. But then there's also something in that that like we do outgrow friendships and we do outgrow relationships depending on our age and our stage and where we're at in the world and where we're at in our lives.
Christine: Um, But with my personal page, like it's all about connection. I'm inviting people into connection. I'm inviting people into belonging. And as you were saying that I'm like, I'm doing it in the place where people feel most disconnected. So maybe it's a space they're looking for that, but also Is it the space they're going to find it?
Christine: I, it's, this is just so interesting for me. And obviously something I've wrestled with, like I, it takes a lot of time and energy. And then also it feels like the lowest hanging fruit when you have a new business, like everyone's like, you just go there and you find your clients. Your ideal clients are just there.
Christine: And yet the truth of it is, is I don't know that anyone has ever reached out to me Because of it. LinkedIn is very different. Like, I have a very, much like you, I have a very intentionally curated space on LinkedIn. It's very aligned. I'm sure that's how we connected originally. Um, it's where I find most people that I connect with for the podcast.
Christine: Um, But yeah, I just have really grappled with it and I, I constantly like watch you from afar and see how kind of beautiful it looks from the outside and how free honestly, or I'll see a LinkedIn post from you and you, I want to comment because I'm like, Oh, that inspired this and there's no comment option.
Christine: And I was like, Oh, look at her with that boundary. It's so beautiful. Every time I'm just like, and then I think, Oh, I should text her. And I was like, no, look at she, she created that space. And I was, I just, I'm just watching and learning, I guess, is what I'm saying, or like witnessing and getting curious about what that really means in a business and how much the should doesn't have to be.
Christine: It's almost just Like, you were explaining this path that many other women on the podcast have talked about where, you know, they went to college and they got this degree and they, and they followed all the paths that they were told was the right path and then got to this point of success and then felt like they had built the right thing and they didn't feel right.
Christine: And so I just, um, I just feel like there's such a, an interesting parallel between those two things, like, it's, it's okay to redefine things and to make them their own, which is, which is something I wanted to talk to you about is like, what, have you had to define success for yourself, so that you could it. Step into this place in your business, because I feel like you have really created something unique in the way you have built your business. And did that start with you defining what you were after, or did it kind of like slowly like shift as you went along the way?
Lila: It's, it started from honestly, and this is going to be a very boring answer, but it's the truth. It started from realizing what I needed to make financially in my household. And it's something whenever I mentor other travel agency owners, I always ask, do you know what you need to make? What's the goal?
Lila: What's your revenue goal? What's your profit goal after expenses? It's really like, it's the base of everything. And the very interesting thing is most women, I've only had one woman that I can remember tell me a number. Most people don't know. And if you don't know what you need to make in your household.
Lila: to be comfortable. And it's there. This isn't a right or wrong thing. It's truly what you need to make in your household, whether you're, uh, whether you live alone, whether you're a single parent, whether you're a dual income household, whatever it is, you know, what you need to make to pay your bills and have the things that you need.
Lila: And most of what you want, I always like not having everything I want. I like working for things. So I know that I know that number. And once you know that number, you can back into the revenue. And, and it, but if you don't know the number, it's incredibly hard to like. I always say to ring the bell at the end of the year because you don't have a bell to ring.
Lila: You don't know what you're working toward. And that's why I think there's so much burnout. And there are just so many people trying to chase this carrot. They don't know what they're trying to chase. They're just chasing and they're, they're unhappy and they're burnout. And they probably are making way, most of the time people are making way more money than they need to in their household.
Lila: Once you actually look at it. So it's probably a long winded way to answer the question, but. It truly was, Oh, wow, this is what I need to make in my household to be comfortable. That means this revenue and sales. And so for me, once I knew that I was, I made a lot of changes in like 2018, 2019. And that's whenever I really got clear on what I needed to make in my household.
Lila: Um, I was touching way more clients than I needed to. I was making more money than I needed to, and I was really, really burnt out. Um, and so I made, I made a bunch of changes. I looked at my client list. I was like, this is going to be, these are the people that I'm going to, I'm going to actively work with.
Lila: If these other people on this side of the list, reach out, we'll see what they reach out to me for. We'll see if it makes sense now that I've made some changes in my business. Um, but it really was kind of cherry picking. And it wasn't the highest spenders that are the most joyful clients. That would be ideal, but it doesn't work out that way.
Lila: There are some that yes, they are some of my highest spenders. I always know it's going to be a ton of time and they're going to be. You know, they're, they're quite needy during planning and during travel. So it wasn't a straight matrix of these are the most profitable. These are the most joyful. It really was like, you know, it was looking at each person, each client individually.
Lila: And that's how I got to a whole lot more balance. Um, and in a ironic, weird way, my revenue now is actually higher, um, just from some of the, the business decisions that I've made, you know, can I afford another catastrophe like a COVID with the, the business decisions and changes that I made? Yeah. 2020 wasn't that bad because of the changes that I had made a few years.
Lila: Um, leading up to that. So to circle back, it really is like figuring out what you need to make in your household and then working into that revenue or that sales from there. But if you don't know that it, you're going to run yourself ragged.
Christine: Yeah, that feels obvious. And yet, honestly, if you asked me the same question, I wouldn't have a number to give to you. So that feels like such a, it's such a way to put the power in your own hands. And the other thing that I was thinking about when, when we met, that was, I think, not long after you had just kind of reduced that client list.
Christine: And I remember sitting with you thinking like, How, like, all of us are sitting here trying to figure out how to grow that list, and grow our email list, and grow every other list, and I was like, she just was like, Just these people. It's like, that is incredible. How can you do that? But it's kind of, The idea of not growth for growth sake, which is again, kind of redefining what success means to you.
Christine: It doesn't mean having the biggest email list and the biggest client list and the most bookings and all of those things. I think it's so important. To really know where you want to go and to be okay with staying there. I mean, you can always adjust it later, but I think so against the business culture, especially in the U.
Christine: S., to just say, like, this is enough. Like, if they're like, Lila, we see you could just grow to here. Wouldn't that be incredible for you to say, like, here's good. That seems So against everything that we're taught about how to be successful. So I guess it's kind of just going back to that point where you just have made that choice.
Christine: But in a such a powerful way of this is what I need This is what I'm going after and that's where I want to be and from your website Somewhere on there. It said something about you know in your in your business Understanding if this is a period of growing or just a period of flowing where you are and I loved that so much How How do you kind of check in and assess that if you're in a period where you would love to look at growth or where you're just happy flowing with where you are?
Lila: I'm, I'm happy flowing. And I think as cliche as it sounds. 2020, 2021 taught me the baseline again, it retaught me a baseline. And I remember at the end of 2020, I remember saying, if this is, if I only ever have this revenue for the rest of my life, I'm okay, because we paid our bills, we had food on the table, um, was still able to save money.
Lila: And that re that reset in my brain as well. And which, which was nice. I think it did. I think 2020, 2021 did a lot to people, but it really did. It set a new, um, I always say it just kind of, it calmed me down again. If that makes sense. I knew that I didn't have to grow. And I also found time for the other things that I love.
Lila: I had more time for photography. I had more time for yoga. I went off and studied yoga. I got a lot of certifications in philosophy and asana and that to kind of reset the baseline for me. I knew that if I had to grow, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have time for the other things in life that I love. And so for me flowing with my agency, where it's at, I, I still say if you know, where I'm at right now, revenue wise, I'm like, if I didn't book another trip this year, I am totally fine.
Lila: It's fine. And I have, I have time for, for other things in life. And so I know not everybody is that way. Everybody's wired differently. And some people are only happy and fulfilled if they are two feet in and growing and there's nothing wrong with the way that I am and my being. Okay. I, I am not happy just being, have just having my agency and having my identity completely wrapped into my agency, having, being able to really learn and grow with photography and, and have my travel images.
Lila: In galleries and in spaces. That's incredibly, I love it. It's so much fun. Um, I love learning about that. I'm actually leaving to go to Mexico in a few weeks to study under a photographer. I do it once a year where I just take a solid week and I study under a photographer that I admire to learn. And I don't want to give that up.
Lila: Those things are so important to like, to my happiness and what I see myself doing in 10, 20, 40 years from now. So that's, I kind of back into it that way, if that makes sense.
Christine: Yeah. And I just, what I love so much is how important you are in the conversation to your decisions, which again, sounds like the craziest thing to say, but I think a lot of us don't put ourself first at all. And I, I, again, I think that's what I admire when I see that boundary. I, there's other women too, that I know I've like, I've seen them put it up and I can't get past it.
Christine: And instead of feeling frustrated, I'm like, okay. Wow. Look at that. Like it is totally possible to do that for yourself. And I, I think it's so admirable and to know, like, I mean, and I have studied, we've talked about this as well. Um, yoga and for me, not like just asana, but like yoga as life. And this year I'm, I'm taking the year and I'm studying Ayurveda and it's, It's because that's what also like makes me feel joyful and it's wisdom that I can bring into this space and I can bring into my travels, but it makes me a better more fulfilled person and it it's I think this is also something that we are never really taught to do is to say like, who am I?
Christine: What makes me happy? Um, if this thing doesn't make me happy, it's okay to say no. Like we're really taught that if you're grinding and you're miserable, you're probably doing it right. Like everybody, like all of our parents had jobs they hated. Maybe not all of them, but like, again, this is what we learned about, right?
Christine: Oh, I'm going to work. I'm Punching that clock. I'm doing the thing. And so I actually, this is my thing that I've been wrestling with. I am terrible at joy. I am so terrible at joy. It's like the hardest thing for me. And if I feel it, I'm like, Oh, push that thing away. Like, I don't know how to be with joy.
Christine: And this is things I've learned through all of my yoga, through Ayurveda, just through that awareness of myself. And so like, I can get into the like martyr and victim, and I can definitely be like, this is awful. Yay. That's great. And if it's joyful, I feel guilty. And so I think that these are, there's a big shift, I think, for people who own their own businesses to have that business because they're craving balance and they're craving control of their own time and their own energy.
Christine: And Curating what their days look like which is one of those things for I wanted to ask you is like when you audit Is that something you think about like? What would I like my days to look like? They don't look like that right now. What can I let go of? What should I pick up? I, I'm curious, like how you allow yourself to be the center of your decisions.
Christine: Um,
Lila: I'm a very like routine person, even when I'm traveling. So like my, my days always start the same, whether I'm here home or if I'm traveling. So I always wake up with plenty of time to make coffee, watch the news. Um, sit with my husband and I'm talking about hours and I fully recognize I don't have children.
Lila: And so it's a whole hell of a lot easier to implement something like this in your daily routine. If I had a child or children, it would look different. It probably wouldn't happen. I would have to figure something else out for me as someone without children. If I have. I have to be somewhere at 9 a. m. I always back into, I back into so many things, so many of my decisions, I'm like looking down the road, I back into everything, whether it's my revenue, whether it's like goals that I have in life, I always back into everything.
Lila: But if I have to be somewhere at 9 a. m. I'm probably waking up at least three hours before, and that's at home or traveling, just because it gives me, I like having an hour, hour and a half, two hours sometimes. To just wake up slowly, have a hot cup of water, make a nice cup of coffee, watch a little bit of news.
Lila: Truthfully, a lot of news. I love world news. I have, I watch the French news. I watch, I watch Al Jazeera. I watch all of them. Um, so I, I just like having that time. I like knowing what's going on in the world from politics to, oh my gosh, there's a flood here or something great's happened over here. I just like, I like news.
Lila: Um, and then check email, make sure there's no fires going on. So I always kind of give myself those, those few hours. I exercise every pretty much every day. Um, even if it's just simple stretch, sometimes I only have 15 minutes. If I'm traveling, I literally throw a shower towel on the floor in my hotel room.
Lila: And I stretch for 15, 20 minutes just to kind of get the kinks out, get the emotions out, get whatever's out. And, um, Go about my day and every day is different. Even when I'm home, you know, every day is different when we're traveling. Certainly every day is different, but I always start my day the same. If I don't start it that way, the day is off the day it's really off.
Lila: So for me, it's having, you know, the, that good three hours, sometimes a little bit more if I want to go out for a run, um, and that's how I. That's how I set my mind right for the day.
Christine: I do have three kids and I'm like three hours in the day, let alone in the morning would be fantastic. I'm like just yesterday, I think I spent six hours driving small humans. Um, so, but I do feel my best when it's 30 minutes. That's what I try to shoot for. Um, so I think it's, it is. relatable, like you can kind of carve that out for yourself if you really need it.
Christine: And I wouldn't say if you really need it, we do really need it. I think it's just something super easy to overlook or to just schedule over. Um, and I say I probably hit it like 50 percent of the time. Um, if it were a hundred percent, I can't imagine who I would be, but I really try to hit it 50 percent of the time.
Christine: And it makes. Um, so I appreciate you sharing that. Um, we talked a little bit about mentoring. You kind of mentioned it, you know, being a preferred way of leading over managing a team. Um, I would love to hear from you, you know, why that's important. Um, I think, I think mentoring is so important. It's been the most valuable thing that's happened to me in my own career, in my own life. receiving mentoring, but also when you find someone that you can connect and share the wisdom that you have with them. Um, why do you think that it's important to spend time with other travel advisors or if you mentor people in other capacities as well?
Lila: I love, I love mentoring. And I'm, I'm, I'm also all, also really honest about the fact that you don't have to have a physical mentor in your life, meaning a lot of my best mentors come from autobiographies from books, really unexpected places. Um, like Anthony Kiedis Biography was one of my favorites and, and it wasn't that I took so much business knowledge away, but it's just life. Um, and, and, and I'm really curious and interested in how people who are the best at what they do, how that came to be. I love hindsight. I love like seeing a story and seeing how it played out.
Lila: Um, looking back on it. And so I love biographies and autobiographies, um, from politicians to rock stars. I think we can glean a ton of information from those in life, which translates to business, in my opinion. Um, so I always say that because a lot of, a lot of women, I hear a lot of women say that they don't have a mentor or they find it really hard to find a mentor.
Lila: And, and it goes, it does go back to balance in, in life. I, I admittedly cannot mentor everyone who has reached out to me to mentor because there are only so many hours in a day. And so I'm always really transparent, like. Biographies and autobiographies get that book can be extremely valuable. And you can also be mentored.
Lila: I always say to like, I have mentors. They have no idea that they are mentors to me. They probably don't even know that I exist there in our travel world and orbit. They probably don't know who I am, but I find, I mean, I get immense. inspiration from just seeing and hearing their story and kind of following what they're doing.
Lila: They have no idea who I am. That's also another avenue for mentoring, but one on one mentoring. Um, I, I love, I love doing because I think the way that, and this could probably be a totally different conversation too, but I think the way that this, the structure on this side of our business is set up in terms of like host agencies with within the travel agency community, there are some agencies and host agencies that do an incredible job of training and mentoring and teaching business acumen.
Lila: I could name two and it's not an exaggeration. They just aren't set up and they don't have the time. To provide true one to one mentoring and having someone who is green or younger come in and just sit alongside a seasoned advisor is Invaluable and it's not happening. And so for me, and this might sound, I hope this comes out the right way, but I I've had, you know, 15 years in, in, in corporate of business of pure, real, you know, very rigid sort of business contracts and all of that kind of heavy stuff, and then coming into travel, I have a lot of experience that just Is second nature.
Lila: So for me, mentoring someone, I don't have to do a lot of preparing. It truly is just kind of answering questions and giving information. And I love it. I, I love it. I wish I had more hours in the day to do it. And I would invite anyone who's listening to this. If you have just a little bit of time, just one person, like one person a year, you can change everything for that person.
Lila: Because all these. Younger people, and I would say even people our age, all they really want is one on one attention. They don't want to be sat in front of another module. Online, they want to talk to someone and, and it's so rare. Again, going back to the whole social media thing and everything's electronic and here, just study this tutorial, this, this, this module study, these eight things, no.
Lila: Like conversation, talk with someone, have someone that you can ask questions to it's it's so rare, so I I'm passionate about it as you can probably tell. I wish I had more time to do it, but yeah, I, I. I love it. And I, I wish that, I wish that more people were, would be interested in doing it too.
Christine: Yeah, I, I think it is really, really valuable. And like you said, the one on one connection, because as I was thinking about it is, It's everything. It's so easy these days. Everything has a course. So it's great because everything has a course. So if you want to learn about it, you can just You know, pay 59, download it, it.
Christine: There you go. You've accumulated the knowledge. However, there is so, something so important about that personal connection, which we've already, you know, discussed multiple times is really missing in our world. And for me, I think that is part of, The podcast, like I think about, I mean, I've essentially been being mentored for four years now, right?
Christine: Every, every conversation is like this mentorship. And I was joking that I'm like, I've gone through like soul of travel university, this, all these conversations. It's incredible that I've been able to speak to the people that I've spoken to. And like, when you line everybody up next to each other and you see this wealth of knowledge, it's, it's mind blowing.
Christine: Like I, the privilege. Is not lost on me at all what this means to have these conversations um, and those moments of mentorship. And I mean, really someone seeing the value in you enough to take the time to just sit and share their wisdom is so huge. I just think we don't get that. I have a few times in college where a professor like saw me and we had a connection and they gave me a little bit more of their energy or a little bit more of their time.
Christine: And it made all the difference. Like it shifted my, you know, majors for courses for me or shifted my career path. Like we don't know the power we wield paying attention to someone. And I think it's incredibly, incredibly important to be a little bit thoughtful about that because we touch a lot of people.
Christine: And like you said, we don't always know who we're touching and we can't be responsible for all of that all the time, but just being conscious of it, I think is important. Um, and. I would like to now talk a little bit about your podcast because I feel like, um, again, we have a lot of similarities. We love these deep conversations talking about, like, I feel like we travel where we talk about very similar, like travel and entrepreneurship and health and spirituality.
Christine: And we're like, how can we bring all of this under this bubble? But we're really lucky because, um, I feel like travel and, and life experiences go hand in hand. So we can kind of touch on everything. Um, so it's so great. Um, I'd love to hear from you how about your podcast, you can tell us a little bit about it and. What part that has played in your journey so far?
Lila: Yeah, it came about, I mean, I love, I love podcasts. I love like, again, I just love like deep dives into things. And, um, I think that, that there's a lot of power and there's actually science behind listening. without having video. Um, you, you retain more, you think about things differently, because if you think about it, you and I are talking, I see you on the screen.
Lila: I'm like, Oh, her hair looks so good. She cut it. Oh, I like that. I love her necklace. You know, I, of course I'm thinking, I'm, I'm listening to what you're saying. And I'm thinking about what you're saying. If you, if you take away the visual distraction and you are only left with audible, it just hits differently.
Lila: And so that's what's super attractive to me about traditional podcasts that don't have have video. And I wanted a way to share, it started because I wanted a way to share a different way of flowing in this business that I don't see talked about because to your earlier point. The only thing that gets airtime and the only model of success are these massive agencies.
Lila: And it's just not true. Like success is different for everyone. You know, what do you need in your household? That's basic, you know? And so I wanted to share stories from other people within, within our travel world, particularly agency owners that I've said, I'm going to do it my way because we're not hearing about it.
Lila: So it started that way. And then because. To me, well being and health and balance and joy to, it just goes hand in hand with business success to me. If you have a healthy body, if you have a healthy mind, if you're confident, you're going to be better in business, you're going to be more successful in business.
Lila: I believe that fully like no hesitation. And I don't see that being talked about. I see. You know, the burnout and the complaining about work and, you know, the health problems that is talked about. And it's almost kind of like a badge. It's almost like rewarded. And I'm like, no, no, we're doing this wrong.
Lila: Let's look at this as a whole system. So I started, I started kind of weaving in what I always say a little bit of woo woo. But yeah, like take time for yourself. Are you exercising? Are you sleeping? Are you eating properly? Are you spending time with your friends? When was the last time you had lunch with a friend or got on the phone with a friend?
Lila: And so it's kind of just a combination of all of that. I love business. I love our business, but I, I think to be successful and to be happy and to be confident, I think Everything else in your world has to be, for the most part, healthy, you know, like you're, you're gonna, you're gonna fall off, you're gonna have bad days, you're gonna have, you know, bad weeks, but in general, are you sleeping?
Lila: Are you eating properly? Are you exercising? Are you confident? Confidence is huge. Um, most of the women that I talked to lack confidence. And they're beautiful and they're successful. I can tell them that other people can tell they have to find that in themselves. And so it's why I talk a lot about. A lot about the woo in addition to, you need, you need to cover it.
Lila: You need to cover your ass a little bit in your business too. You know, I think it all, it all, and, and that, then that's kind of what I like talking about on the podcast, just having these conversations again, because I can't give, I don't have enough time to give my time to everyone. So hopefully some of those conversations will be a bit of, of ancillary mentoring to people
Christine: Yeah, absolutely. And for people listening, I don't think we've either one mentioned, but it's, your podcast is called choices. Um, and it's, is it on all platforms or is it just on Spotify?
Lila: just on Spotify.
Christine: That's what I thought because I was also like, Hmm. There's an interesting choice that she made, and I'm curious about why, that it's just there.
Christine: Everything about you has just this air of exclusivity, and I don't know if that's done so intentionally, but I'm like, man, it's so good, because it's like, I'm here, but I'm not there. I'm here, but I'm not there. I'm like, oh, it's so good. It's so good. And, and I feel so grateful. Like I said, we've only had one other conversation beside this.
Christine: So I know I, I, I felt the energy of you. So it doesn't feel, um, exclusive. It doesn't feel pretentious. But it feels very, very intentional. And so, um, yeah, I just, I, I love that. So, Spotify only, find choices. Um, I've really enjoyed your conversations. I love hearing, um, from people that I know there. And, and just like hearing you walk through their story in a different way.
Christine: Even especially people that maybe we've both talked to. And, It's so fun for me to have that, that experience. Um, well, before we end our conversation, Lila, I have just a few rapid fire questions to wrap us up. So the first one is what are you reading right now?
Lila: I am reading Good Energy.
Christine: Uh, what is always in your suitcase or backpack when you travel?
Lila: Always in my suitcase, I take adaptogenic mushrooms every day. Not psychedelic, adaptogenic. A must.
Christine: Yeah, I actually right as I asked it, I was like, Ooh, I bet it's some sort of like, um, immune system, something, something, um, to sojourn to me is to travel somewhere as if you live there for a short while, whereas someplace that you would still love to
Lila: I have a soft spot for the English countryside, so I'll probably always return there and can spend a lot of time there. Really peaceful to me.
Christine: sojourn. What do you eat that immediately connects you to a place you've been?
Lila: Mm, it depends on the destination. I mean, some kind of curry in India. Um, always a fish taco on a beach in Mexico. Depends where I am.
Christine: Yeah. Who was a person that inspired you or encouraged you to set out to travel the world?
Lila: My paternal grandmother.
Christine: Grandma's for the win in this space. Someday. I'm going to figure out how many it's been. What percentage, um, if you could take an adventure with one person fictional or real alive or past, who would it be?
Lila: Ooh, gosh.
Lila: Oh, it's so hard. I, in a weird way, I would love, I would love to know like my old, old, old ancestors and like, hang out with them and be somewhere with them, wherever they came from.
Christine: That would be great. Um, as you know, soul of travel is a space for recognizing women in the industry. Um, who is one woman that you admire and would like to bring attention to here in our conversation?
Lila: Right now in this moment, probably Ann Bigging, who started Healing Hotels for the World.
Christine: Thank you. Um, well, thank you so much for your time today. I'm so glad that we were able to, to find the time to be able to do this for you to share, um, your wisdom with us. And I look forward to hopefully connecting with you in the real world again soon.
Lila: Yeah, you too.
You can find me on Facebook at Lotus Sojourns on Facebook, or join the Lotus Sojourns Collective, our FB community, or follow me on Instagram either @lotussojourns or @souloftravelpodcast. Stay up to date by joining the Lotus Sojourns mailing list. I look forward to getting to know you and hopefully hearing your story.